Heather Pridemore: Today's guest is Jim Reiman, a multi talented photographer, designer, filmmaker, and educator with a career spanning over two decades. Jim earned his BFA in photography and digital imaging from Central Washington University and his MFA from the University of South Florida. His creative work delves into pop cultural archetypes and individuals with alter egos featured in various solo and group exhibitions, as well as film festivals. As a commercial artist, he has collaborated with clients from the entertainment industry and small businesses to large corporations. Since 2007, Jim has been sharing his expertise as an art and design educator, teaching at institutions like the University of South Florida, the Art Institute of Tampa, and currently serving as the chair of graphic design and photography at Rocky Mountain College of Art and Design.

Welcome to the show, Jim.

Jim Reiman: Hi Heather. Thanks for having me.

Heather Pridemore: So, for those who are listening, Jim and I actually met at University of South Florida. I was an undergrad and Jim was in his graduate program and Jim was also my roommate. So, my husband, Jim and I all, all live together. 

Jim Reiman: Yeah, I needed a place to live and you generously offered a extra room. 

Heather Pridemore: So, so Jim and I go way back. I was trying to remember how many years it has been the other day. I was trying to remember when I graduated and, and I want to say it was around like maybe 2007. So I would have met you maybe like 2006, 2007. So, so we go way back.

Jim Reiman: Yeah. Yeah. I think it was probably, January or February of 2006 I visited USF and that's where we met.

Heather Pridemore: You have a better memory than I do. Now one of the things I was hoping we talk about Jim, first of all, is your work history, because while you have done so many amazing things in, academics and in, you know, creative endeavors, you had jobs before that. And I always thought that was kind of interesting.

And so I was hoping you could share a bit about, you know, what you do now, but then also the work that you did before you established your career in art and academics.

Jim Reiman: Okay, how far back are we going? Like,

Heather Pridemore: mean, I don't know how far back is it. Is it interesting? I mean, I know what you were doing like right before you came to University of South Florida. And so

I always thought that was kind of interesting. But, but I mean, what other kind of work? I guess, I guess what I really want to get to the crux of Jim is like, people have these ideas that like careers are like really linear. And while I would say to some degree, your academic and art career has been fairly linear, there was like a whole bunch of other stuff you did beyond that. And so I think it's worth talking about. Yeah.

Jim Reiman: Yeah. And I, I don't know if I would say it's totally linear, like sometimes it's on multiple tracks at the same time.

So, and I think that's just like, uh, like the create no creative path is exactly the same or, or direct, I think as well. I guess I started my creative career when I was in high school, I guess like, like right after high school where I started shooting weddings.

And, I also did some graphic design work. I designed, fruit packing boxes, like fresh out of high school. So I designed a logo that they're still using right now, which is weird because that logo is old enough to rent a car. Um, but, that was kind of like my first kind of step into getting creative work.

And then from there, I ended up going to college. And, I went in just looking at a bachelor of fine arts. That was sort of general and, I went into a community college and in community college, there was like, there was a direct transfer to my undergrad, the university, so I went ahead and did sort of the general ed stuff.

And then I went into a central Washington University where I basically had to choose a path and it was like, Do you want to do drawing and painting? Do you want to do ceramics? Do you want to do metal smithing or photography? Which is where I ended up, uh, at because I like, I've always done lots of different creative things.

And so I wasn't really sure which way I wanted to go at first. So I think I initially put drawing and painting and I, and I know now that it was, I'm really glad that I didn't do that because the photo path offered, opened up a lot more opportunities. But you know, uh, the photo path also there, it kind of met the need that I, like, I do like science.

And so, there was an element of science in, photography as well as the creative component, which kind of fulfilled a couple of different parts of me that, that I just really, you know, felt like I could learn a lot. And then I was working in a fish market during that. So I was fileting salmon and cleaning Dungeness crabs and, and going to art school on, you know, throughout the week and graduated.

And then I worked at a photo studio as a retoucher for a little while. At the same time I was working night crew on a grocery store, trying to save up money to move to Florida. I was taking on photo shoots, the kind of small clients. And then I ended up in Florida, where I went to grad school and then I got, well, I, I got a little bit of teaching while I was an undergrad cause I was also the dark room tech, which, put me in close proximity with the faculty and the students and, all the tools of the trade.

So, uh, just gave me a lot of experience that way, but that ended up helping when I went to grad school because then I started getting teaching opportunities as a graduate assistant. I also worked at an art store on the weekends and then a caricature artist after the arts, the art store thing didn't work out so well.

And that's just why I was in school. 

Heather Pridemore: I think Jim, before we get into teaching, I just want to like backtrack a little bit because as you were talking about, especially during your college years, you talked a lot about working a lot of different types of jobs. And one of the things that I have found is that like, and this is anecdotal, I mean, there's like, I have no scientific evidence behind any of this, but I do find that with a lot of, Creatives or people with creative backgrounds, you know, myself, for example, I have a creative background, but my work hasn't necessarily been in a creative space. Yet,

I still have that desire to sort of be doing a lot of different things all at the same time. And so. What I've noticed and maybe you can speak to this is like when you're in the creative space, it's like partly survival that you do a lot of different things because you're kind of piecing together a career as a way of like paying your bills and like sort of feeding your, your soul and, and all the things, but then on the flip side, I don't know, maybe you feel this way too, but like, there's also this sort of desire that you like, just like to be doing a lot of different types of things.

And so that's why this sort of multi passionate multi hyphenate approach to, to career and life just works for people in the creative space.

Jim Reiman: Yeah, I would say that that's something that I still do. Like, uh, like I do feel like I have to be, doing something all the time. And I think, that probably drives my wife crazy because, because that'll turn into weird little projects around the house and things like that too, just that, like, just wanting to be busy, I guess.

And I think I probably, I don't know, I kind of just developed that. That way of working from the time I was in like high school with multiple side gigs and stuff. So yeah, yeah, I totally understand that.

Heather Pridemore: Now, Jim, when you were kind of working, you know, had a job while you were in college and you were doing some, you know, sort of freelance creative projects, but you were also working in like the grocery store or the fish market. And I'm just curious, like, why, like, why choose that when, when maybe you could have taken on some additional creative projects and kind of just like doubled down on the creativity was, was there anything in that sort of hands on like type of environment that just appealed to you?

Jim Reiman: You know what I think it really was was maybe I didn't know how to get the, those gigs right away. Like, cause I was still pretty young. And then, you know, I didn't have like the clientele built up. I think, also that particular job helped build some of the soft skills that, I use in my day to day job now and also when I'm working with clients too.

So I think that those sort of like customer service things actually have made me more well rounded in terms of how I deal with, with my clients that I work with on the side or my students or the faculty or administrators, things like that.

Heather Pridemore: That's an interesting reflection, Jim. Can you say any more about some of those like skills that you feel like you developed when you were in that sort of more customer service space?

Jim Reiman: Yeah. Um, well, I, I know that I can naturally be very introverted. I know that I have to kind of push myself to, like, interact with people because I just want to just do things but I don't necessarily, like, naturally, I'm not somebody who wants to just, like, chat a lot. But I think those jobs, they sort of required me initiating with strangers, like people I don't know.

I'm like, Hey, how you doing? Looking for some halibut today. I don't know. You know? So, I think that there's a level of like the soft skills, the interactions with people, I think that helped. And, and when I was an undergrad, I ended up using that to help me do different types of projects where I would photograph strangers and show up at their homes.

And I definitely used a lot of the stuff I learned working in a fish market as a, as a way to help kind of like, you know, connect and, have these different conversations with people I didn't know. So, I think that that's really where this is like, just those, the building of those soft skills.

That's the thing that a lot of artists struggle with. And I see that daily in my job now. And, I try to, to share that whenever I can. 

Heather Pridemore: So I can relate, Jim, I am a, I'm a high functioning introvert and people meet me and they often don't like, they're like, Oh no, you're not, you're not an introvert. And, you know, I think if I had to simplify it, you know, to its simplest definition, like I recharge alone and I find environments with lots of people can be very taxing, but it doesn't mean I can't function in them.

And it's for the same reasons that you developed, right? Like I, I worked in hospitality, I've worked in sales, I've worked in customer service and I've gotten, I've developed, you know, skills to survive and even thrive in some of those environments, but it doesn't necessarily mean that it always sits the most comfortable, like internally, because it can be overwhelming and it can be really taxing.

 And so I relate totally and, and could not recommend more to people to, you know, get in those customer service spaces and like learn some of those skills. I love people who work in like hospitality, like every job I've ever worked, if you've worked hospitality, you probably could do almost any job that I've ever had because the skills are the transferable skills are there. And so, what I hear you talking about really is like, you know, developing some transferable skills that while, you know, they were developed in, let's say, a grocery store. They now have permeated to, your roles as like an artist and a teacher and an administrator. So,

Jim Reiman: So I was a caricature artist in grad school at Busch Gardens and those soft skills, like, like that's how you get people to sit down. And then like, I, I, that job, I never wanted to make hourly. I always wanted to make commission. So you have to be like friendly and like kinda, you know, like, Hey, how are you doing?

You guys having a good time? I mean, like you learn how to make small talk with people. And, you know, the theme park, it's pretty easy to do that. You're like, Oh, what ride did you just ride? And then, that would kind of work into the way that I would like talk to them while I was drawing them. So it's, it's something that is definitely very helpful.

Heather Pridemore: Well, I think this is a good segue, Jim, because I want to talk a little bit about working in academia. And the reason I think this is sort of interesting is like when you think of, of a university or, or like an academic setting, you think of a bureaucracy and bureaucracies are sort of the opposite of like creativity and like, multi hyphenate, multi passionate, like, multi project focused, work. And so, what I'm really curious about is how being in those spaces has been for you, how it's influenced, you know, your career decisions and the opportunities that you're experiencing in more of, like, the artistic creative spheres.

Jim Reiman: Sure. Yeah. So I've worked at three different colleges. I've worked at, University of South Florida, which was the art department was kind of like an island, at the major university. Like the art classes were happening. And, as an adjunct to, you know, I basically just had to show up, teach my class.

And, you know, there wasn't, there wasn't like, I didn't see a lot of the inner workings. I talked to the faculty, the full time faculty a lot, but I didn't see as much of the, the behind the scenes, bureaucracy, drama, whatever, until I got to the Art Institute, which was a for profit college, where I was, I started out in adjunct and then became a full time faculty member.

And there I, you know, I, I saw like the admissions, like the, I'd have to start working with admissions. I never saw an admissions person at a state university, even though they're there and it's, it's a business just like any other. But, you know, all of a sudden I am working directly with the admissions team, the registrar, the, my department, my direct report, which are the person I was directly reporting to, which is my department chair.

And there was a lot of navigating faculty, spaces, you know, who's responsible for this or that, or, who's going to come in and work this open house event or, you know, how can these classes work with the community? So we did a lot of different community based projects, which I was really proud of while we were there.

 So there was, you know, in the classes we were producing art and we were doing creative, projects for the, the community, but then there was also this level of, okay got to keep our numbers up. You gotta do the, you know, you got to make sure your classes are full. Like I, that's where I started getting a lot of the administrative skills.

Like I had to start scheduling classes, and making sure that they had so many people in them to run them. And, my department chair, who's a really good friend of mine, he's still, he basically taught me a lot of the administrative stuff and then like, gave me a lot of opportunities to grow in that area.

And that helped me move into the position that I'm at now at RMCAD. And so RMCAD's a little, a little different because everything's a little bit more collaborative than it was at the Art Institute, because at the Art Institute, there was still like this. entity above everybody. And then every now and then they would just lay people off.

And so, the reason I left there was because I started seeing the writing on the wall. It was like every so often people, faculty were getting laid off and it was worth seeking out another opportunity. So, it just happened that I was doing a shoot up in Nashville and somebody, one of my friends sent me a message is like, Hey, we're looking for a department chair and I think you'd be really good at this.

You should apply. And I did. And now I oversee the two departments. So now that I oversee two departments, I've got the graphic design team. I've got the photography team. Personality wise, they're very different. I find it really interesting kind of navigating both because I came into the graphic design role with more of a photography background.

I've done graphic design projects, but I have most of my education as a photographer. Most of my freelance work is as a photographer. So I was kind of like looked at as a photographer running a graphic design program. And then when I started working with the photo faculty, they thought I was a graphic designer coming over and overseeing a photo department.

So I had to like really show both of them that I understand how, how both areas work and they're really not all that different. But I have a really close, a pretty close relationship with the executive team. So the, the team above me. I had a really good relationship with the previous provost. We're actually looking for a new provost now, but I expect that would be the same.

 I have the, I work really closely with all the other department chairs, and we have big projects and we have little projects and we're just, you know, we just try to try to do as much as we can for our students. And I think what's cool about there is that I really feel like everybody, even people at the very top, have the students best interests in mind.

It doesn't feel as much of the push, push, push like the Art Institutes did.

Heather Pridemore: There's a couple of things I want to sort of like zoom in on there that you talked about, Jim. So because of my own knowledge of, the art world and especially the, creative, like academic space, I know that it's, it's kind of a small world, but it's also highly competitive. And one of the things that I noticed in your stories about not only your development

within your role, but also when you were able to find the role at RMCAD is that it was someone from within your circle or your network that reached out and said, Hey, here's an opportunity or Hey, let me help you. And so can you speak a little bit about, you know, your, your circle of influence, the network that you keep and how you maintain sort of those connections that lead to both, I would assume both personal and professional development.

Jim Reiman: Yeah, I mean, it's, I mean, people say this all the time. It's about who you know, and I think that's, that's absolutely true. Like, if people know you and they know you do a good job, they'll recommend you to, to others for different types of roles, so. I mean, I guess I got the Art Institute role through one of the curators at the camp who happened to be talking to somebody from the Art Institute and they, they like in passing met each other and they're like, Oh yeah, we're looking for faculty.

And then they're like, Oh, you should give Jim Reiman a call. And so they did. And that's how I got that role. And then I worked hard. I love my job. I love the students. Some of the people I went to grad school with that I knew were pretty good teachers and were also really passionate. I helped get them, teaching jobs at the Art Institute.

And then when they moved on to other places, they extended that back to me. So like my friend, Rob, he was teaching with me at the Art Institute. He got an opportunity through. Somebody from his past to come out to a RMCAD. And when it was, when they were needing some people, Rob reached out to me and he was like, Hey, I think you'd be really good for this.

And, and you know, even I would say now that I'm in a hiring position, I do look at people that I know that are looking and if I can give them opportunities, I do.

Heather Pridemore:  That's it's, it's interesting though. Cause Jim, you know, I think often when we think about like networking and like leveraging our networks, people often think of like, I don't know, for lack of a better phrase, like social climbers, but I I've known you a long time and I've never, that's not your, persona, right?

Like you're not someone who is just like, Ooh, who can I connect with? Who's going to be like my next like stepping stone? You're making just like friends and genuine connections and it's all leading to, to what you were just describing. And so I think it's just worth sort of saying, because I think sometimes we think, Oh, well, I'm an introvert and I don't desire that sort of like transactional relationship. So I can't get ahead in life. And I think what you just explained is like quite the opposite of that. You're like, I do a good job. I maintain connections. I, I give people a hand up when I can, people then in turn, give me a hand up when they can.

And, you know, and so it's a little bit more, community focused.

Jim Reiman: Sure. Yeah, totally. And the art world is, it's pretty small in the sense that I still go to SPE every year, which is Society for Photographic Education. And people that were there when I was an undergrad, I meet up with them and people that I met in grad school, I meet up with them and we, we stay connected.

I just, I'm doing these national portfolio days right now. I've been traveling a lot for the last few weeks and through the end of November. And I'm running into people that I know from different schools. Just saying hello, maybe we grab lunch or something or, and, just, just keeping in touch with everybody.

Heather Pridemore: Another thing you mentioned is that you're very close with your executive team. And I was curious, Jim, on that front. Do you think that the the it's part of the RMCAD culture, which is what is facilitating that closeness, or do you feel like that is more about a certain level of like self advocacy and, some of those soft skills that you talked about earlier.

So is it more like self directed that you have that relationship, or do you feel like that's just kind of the culture that permeates RMCAD?

Jim Reiman: I would say it's a little bit of both. I would say I've maybe have a little bit better relationship with the executive team than some people do because I'm like out there trying to, I believe in what we're doing. And so I'm willing to go above and beyond and do the types of things that, that maybe it's not part of my job description because I love it.

 But that we do have a very sort of family like atmosphere at the college, which, is hard to describe. Like at USF, it was, people were pretty tight knit, but they were also very competitive with one another. And at AI, it didn't have the warmth that there is at, at RMCAD. And even though we've had different presidents and things like that, and people in different roles, there's always this sense of community there, which I really enjoy.

Heather Pridemore: Now I've visited the RMCAD campus and there's definitely also like an intimacy to, the campus. And so I wonder, you know, just kind of off the top of my head, how much that also contributes to that warmth that you feel because there is such a, uh, I don't know. It's it's like a different environment. I mean, you think about USF is very much a state college, you know, it's, it's it's big and, and there's lots of different people doing lots of different things there and, and agree the art department was always a bit of an island. And then you think of something like, the Art Institute. And in my mind, I, I have no personal firsthand experience with Art Institute, but to me, it's more of like a machine, like a little bit more corporate for, like, yeah. Yeah, for like an art education institution and then you have RMCAD, which, for anyone who ever visits there, it's like leaving Denver and like, I don't know, landing in Vermont. Like it's, it's so intimate, this like tiny little, like, cute campus just feels like worlds away from like downtown Denver and like the area that surrounds it.

And so it's, there's a level of just, I just, intimacy is the word that always comes to mind, but

Jim Reiman: I always think of it as like a Hogwarts for artists. 

Heather Pridemore: that's cute. So I want to, I want to move on a little bit here because I think one of the interesting things that we can talk about, Jim, is the sort of concepts that sit behind your work. And so, you know, in your bio, we talked about the fact that you explore pop cultural archetypes and alter egos. And I'd really be interested to hear how you think these concepts sort of reflect or challenge the personal and collective identities within society today.

Jim Reiman: I like to photograph people who kind of like take on different roles. So a lot of my recent work has been more client based, but I'm still doing that. I'm working, I've worked with like professional wrestlers and actors and, dominatrixes and all kinds of different types of people. I just, you know, I like to photograph people who kind of take on these different roles.

And And when I photograph them, I try to make them feel really powerful and like, like superheroes. It's something I've always been like, I'm, I'm a comic nerd, always have been. So in a lot of ways it's sort of like, like photographing action figures or something, you know? It's, it's just, I, I have a lot of fun with it, but I think, in society there's, you know, there's a lot of let's see, trying to portray yourself in different ways, trying to put on different masks. 

And so I think and that's, you know, now it's like ingrained in our culture. I think this is like superheroes and everything. Like you can't go to the theater without seeing a movie poster for something like that, which wasn't the case when I was growing up. But now it's like, I think, there's something in the, in the air that, that people are responding to this idea of like being beyond going beyond yourself and, you know, becoming someone. Who's able to do the things that you as an individual can't. So I don't know. I've always just been interested in that. And I always think it's really interesting talking to somebody who intentionally transforms themselves into someone else.

Heather Pridemore: I mean, that's a very, like, those are all very extreme sort of, um, examples of people who, who transform into, you know, other alter egos or whatever, but I think it's, it's sort of like, at least for me, kind of conceptually interesting to think about to like people in a professional environment are also donning some form of alter ego, you know, and so, I mean, there is a sort of a reflection or a mirroring that's sort of taking place when you think about,

you know, costumes or, reflections of identity. I mean, you know, just a couple of years ago, I would not have had, alternative colored hair or tattoos that I couldn't cover up. But in the last couple of years, I've really tried to embrace more of my internal identity, like outwardly. But prior to that, I was

donning a, I mean, I don't want to call it a costume, but in a way it was like a costume, you know, it was like, well, what version of Heather needs to exist in this environment versus what version of Heather needs to exist in this environment? And so my, you know, my, the way I dressed was partially a reflection of the character that I needed to play.

And so, I mean, there, there are some interesting parallels. And so I don't know, like, do you think much about that as you're, you're doing this work, Jim, about sort of like the, the personas, the alter egos of like the everyday person.

Jim Reiman: Yeah. Yeah. I do think about that because I, well, it depends on like what the purpose of the shoot is, but when I'm photographing, so I definitely, would like to do some stuff where maybe I photograph, somebody as their regular self and then, you know, and really draw the, the, the contrast between the two roles.

But I, like, like you, I'm in my, my work uniform. I put on my plaid and I, you know, go out there and, and do, Jim Reiman in public. So I totally understand what you're saying about that, the, the work persona, or, you know, the costume that you put on to be in different realms. 

Heather Pridemore: Let's talk about that about you for a second, Jim. So as a creative, right, you're, you're probably not feeling the same, constraints, navigating both the sort of personal and the professional. And, and I would, I would assume, and I'm making some really grand assumptions here that those things are fairly in alignment most of the time.

 I mean, do you, do you feel like being a, an artist and a creative person gives you sort of the freedom to live maybe a little bit more authentically.

Jim Reiman: Yeah, maybe. I haven't really thought about it, but I don't like necessarily think about. Yeah. Yeah, I think. Yeah, probably I haven't really thought about it in that sense, but I do think that because I have this sort of like art persona, I can cut my hair once a year or something like that. Like, I don't really worry about, necessarily how I show up because how I show up, it feels pretty much like me. 

Heather Pridemore: Do you find yourself advising your students in these areas? So like a lot of the things that we talk about on this show are things like, professional branding, right? Like our personal brand, how are you putting yourself out into the world? We talk about things like, curated or co opted, authenticity.

So, you know, kind of, managing the, the parts of yourself that you want to show the world, but in a way that's still is very much aligned with like your values and, and your, your identity and all of these things. And so, you know, these are things that come up, I think a lot when you're talking to people about that intersection of the personal and the professional.

And so I'm just wondering like, what kind of advice are you giving to your students as they're, as they're graduating and going off into these, these creative spaces? No 

Jim Reiman: no, that's, that's a really great question. And it does come up in nearly every portfolio review and, and every sort of class is dedicated around professional practice or, professional development. And so, you know, we start out by little things like, well, what do you want to do? Well, don't put the type of work you don't want to do on your website because that I, you know, that's probably what you're going to get if you, if you do. And then like really thinking about your, like both the graphic design students and the photo students. They sort of like craft their design philosophy or their, their artist statement or their, you know, just their, their perspective on what it means to be a designer or photographer. And we try to get them to dig into their values.

Like, do you want to work for nonprofits? You know, we were really like, we really try to talk to them as like, you know, being agents of change when they, when they get out of school and they go off to do whatever it is, you know, whatever stories they're telling with their cameras, whatever clients they're working with through design, how they persuade people through their, their work.

And we talked to them about the responsibility of that. We talked to them about, you know, if you're trying to get, if you're trying to move into this realm, you want to be aware of this factor or that factor. So we, we do have a lot of those conversations and, you know, we try to try to have them show up as authentically as possible, but, but also professionally.

Heather Pridemore: Okay, you'ree gonna have to break it down for me, Jim. What does that mean? Authentically, but, but professionally. 

Jim Reiman: Like that, they are designing work that is meaningful to them, but gives them opportunities within the career that they're looking for. So let's say they want to, I don't know, they want to design. for B corporations, right? They want to design for, they want to do work that is focused on environmental consciousness or something like that. We try to make sure that that's the work that they're showing. And if that's something they're really passionate about, we encourage them to take the assignment guidelines and then make work that falls within that. Like to, to use the guidelines, just as guidelines, but they put themselves into the, the, intent and the,the overall execution.

And then when they talk about that, when they graduate, they've got this collection of work that is meaningful to them, but also is applicable to a career. We're very human centered focused where we're thinking about, you know, who are you designing for? And in the case of the graphic designers, it's more about, you know, What are you trying to say?

And who are you saying it to? And I guess for photography as well, but there's a little bit more opportunity maybe for personal expression. Maybe not. I don't even know if I feel comfortable saying that there's personal expression available in both parts. 

Heather Pridemore: Most creatives or artists have some sort of like artist statement or, some sort of statement about like the work that they create, the, what, like what's meaningful to them. And. I mean, there are honestly very few other career paths I can think of where people are so intentional in sort of framing in that statement, but the stories that we tell about our careers are no less important than an artist being able to craft an artist statement to say like, this is what my work is about.

And so, could you talk just a little bit about the sort of the advice that you give students about how to craft their artist statements? Because I think that that would be just as relevant to people who are thinking about crafting the story of their career. And like, what makes that meaningful? 

Jim Reiman: The crafting of the design philosophy or artist statement is something that we do in tiers. So we start out with a, kind of basic template. Who are you? What do you do? Why do you do it? What, and what, what do you do that makes this unique to you? And so that's kind of like the initial framework. And then we also try to have them put in like their, like one year goal, three year goal, five year goal, 10 year goal. And then those things evolve as we move through. And we, we kind of, we have sessions where we kind of we, we look at what the statement says, we look at the work, and we look to see if there's any sort of like anything that contradicts or something that's not present. Like if the student is saying that they love this, but you can't see that present in the work, then that's an area of opportunity for them or they just remove it from the statement, one of, one or the other. And it's, it's a writing practice that it starts out as a writing practice. And then it becomes an oral practice where they are, where they're actually like presenting it verbally in a presentation with their portfolio. And then ideally the writing practice trains the student how to speak about themselves when they're in an interview situation, down the road. So that, that's kind of the way that we look at it. This sort of like tiered way of, building up who you are as a designer and your ability to, to talk about it and show that in the examples of work itself.

Heather Pridemore: And I assume just like, any sort of life journey that evolves over time, right? Like I'm, I'm sure the artist statement that you would have had 10 years ago is probably a little different maybe than the one that you would have today. 

Jim Reiman: Yeah. We were always saying, Hey, this thing's never done. This thing is never done. Your web, like your portfolio is never done. Your resume is never done. Like, you know, all of those things are continually growing with you.

Heather Pridemore: I mean, making art is honestly a pretty good metaphor for life. It's much more about the journey and the evolution, then like, then sometimes the final product. Right. And so if you're a commercial artist, of course, the final product's important cause that's how you get paid, but that process that you evolve over time and the work that you develop over time and how that evolves the way you think and interpret the world, I mean, that's, that's like a great metaphor for life.

We're all on very similar journeys. When you were talking about the process of creating the statement, you talked about like the writing and sort of the elevator pitch of, you know, being able to sort of articulate that. And then also the fact that it's very like consistently reflective. So you're going back and you're reassessing.

And so, you know, one of the things I think for anybody who's sort of navigating, um, You know, careers kind of needs the same thing. You should be having regular check ins to say like, is the path I'm on the right one, or do I need to like sort of edit the story that I'm telling or, has something changed that I'm now like heading in a new direction.

So like everything kind of needs to evolve. And it's one thing it's interesting that like, there there's such a level of intention, at least within the space of, of what you're teaching, but we don't, we're not really taught that in a, in a corporate or like professional environment to have that sort of check in with ourselves, right?

Like that continual, Hey, does this still match or am I still heading in the direction that I intended? And so I think, I think that's a really interesting takeaway for, for anyone who's listening.

Jim Reiman: You know, the other part of that too, like the, you know, when you're doing all that stuff, having people that you trust to look it over and, and see what you're saying versus what you're showing, like, and that's where those, the, going back to your, question about networking and like the circle of people that you keep around yourself, I think that's, you know, you can always go back to them to have them check and be like, Hey, is this going in the right direction? And, uh, usually the people that come out of that space, they're very honest. and they understand how to give you feedback in a way to help you grow.

Heather Pridemore: And if you don't have that person, you can always hire a coach. I mean, that's what coaches are for. 

Jim Reiman:That's true. Yeah.

Heather Pridemore: is to help with that stuff. 

Well, Jim, we are coming close to the end of the episode and I love to kind of wrap each conversation up by saying, if someone said this was way too long, I did not listen.

What is like one thing you'd want them to take away from our conversation?

Jim Reiman:Just be a good person and do the thing you love. I think that's a like, as long as your, your heart's in it, then you're doing the right thing.

Heather Pridemore: Awesome. Well, thank you so much, Jim. It was great having a chat with you. And, I do appreciate you taking some time to, to share your perspective with us.

Jim Reiman: Yeah. Thank you.