Heather Pridemore: Today I'm joined by Lisa Poliak, the Founder and Director of Inner Genius Prep, a boutique educational and career consulting company based in Santa Monica, California. Lisa loves helping her clients succeed, whether through getting into their top choice college or grad school, or landing the job of their dreams.

Before founding Inner Genius Prep in 2009, she received her MFA in Creative Writing from Brooklyn College, a top 10 program, and worked as a writer and editor primarily in educational publishing. She founded Inner Genius with the belief that everyone has an inner genius within them that needs to be activated and encouraged in order for them to reach their full potential.

Her specialties include individualized coaching for writing application essays and resumes, and acing interviews. Today Lisa uses her holistic approach to personal growth with a wide range of clients to empower them to present their best selves, authentically shine, and achieve their goals. Welcome to the show, Lisa.

Lisa Poliak: Thank you, Heather. I'm so excited to be here with you today.

Heather Pridemore: So it's so interesting that last sentence in your bio about presenting their best selves, authentically shine and achieve their goals. I feel like we're gonna talk a lot about that during this episode. 

Lisa Poliak: I'm excited to talk about that because that's what I love to do and that's what I think is so important for people to be able to do. 

Heather Pridemore: Now, one of the things I think is, gonna be special about this episode is the thing that we connected on. So when we met at the workshop, we right away were like, Hey, we're both entrepreneurs, we're both working in, kind of the career, you know, career space, and you've been an entrepreneur for a number of years.

And I would just, I, I'd just love to just jump right in and talk about how did you navigate the transition from traditional employment, which it looks like maybe you were doing some educational publishing to creating your own career path.

Lisa Poliak: I wouldn't say I was ever a hundred percent traditionally employed because I'm someone who likes to travel a lot, and I never really wanted to be tied down. In an office of only having two weeks vacation, to be frank. And so I always worked freelance my entire career, which sometimes is actually really harder than having a full-time job because you don't have benefits and you don't have, you know, the guaranteed salary.

But I had a lot of different freelance jobs. Working as an editor and as a copy editor when I lived in New York during grad school and then after getting my Master's in creative writing, and I worked as a copy editor for quite a few years and really felt that it was a very low use of my skills because I really love people and I love writing and I love teaching people how to write, and being a copy editor, you kind of just sit alone at a desk all day and don't really get any interaction unless someone comes back and yells at you three months later 'cause you missed a comma or something like that. And so it wasn't that I really ever was completely traditionally employed, but I was always working for other people. And so I took the step from working for other people to working for myself.

Heather Pridemore: Now, what made that transition occur for you? What made you make that leap, right, that leap of faith for yourself - kind of bet on yourself, Lisa?

Lisa Poliak: Well, after I was working as a copy editor, when I moved back to Los Angeles where I'm from, I actually got a job working as an SAT tutor, and that was very random in a way. I answered an ad on Craigslist and I ended up working for this company. That was a very high-end company working with kids in the college prep world, and I discovered that I was really good at it and that I really connected with teenagers and my personality went really well with working with teenagers and they really liked me. And most of my students were doing really well, far beyond the norm of what's expected with expectation of improvement of their scores. And I also at the time was really heavily studying personal growth work and doing a lot of work about meditation and mindset and beliefs and things like that. And I was incorporating what I was doing with my own students and I was like, I'm really good at this.

I should start my own company. And then I also thought that with my writing background, I could coach students on doing their college essays. In addition, working for someone else they really didn't incentivize you to stay with the company the way the employees were treated as far as the compensation because what they charged the families and then what they paid the people that were doing the work.

And I didn't feel like it was a very good model, and I had never really thought of that as a career path before. And I didn't know much about educational consulting, but I realized I'm really good at this and I love it. And also it was the first job I had where I really, I used to always say, every other job I ever had, I could go in in a good mood and come out in a bad mood.

And this job, when I started working with teenagers, some days if I would go in in a bad mood, I would come out in a good mood because I enjoyed it so much. So I just realized, oh, this is something that I'm good at, that I can do, that I can create a career out of. And I just went for it.

Heather Pridemore: So there's a couple things I'd like to unpack there, Lisa. One of the things that you talked about was, you'd been working more of a traditional ish model and then you found this like test prep and then that is what sprung board you into this entrepreneurial journey. But I'm just curious, were you ever, did you ever consider previous to that, ever starting your own business?

Was that ever a thought you had?

Lisa Poliak: Now, and I never studied business in my life. I got my undergrad in international studies and did creative writing the whole time, and my master's in creative writing. I never took a business class in my life and it had never ever occurred to me to start my own business. And little side note, one time I was at a family holiday and my brother-in-law's sister said to me, oh, you should become one of those high price test prep tutors.

And I said, I would never do that in a million years. And then that's exactly what I did.

Heather Pridemore: That's funny. You also mentioned when you were talking about you know, this transition that you were doing a lot of self-work and you were using that with your clients, but I'm just curious, like what role do you think all of that self-work, the meditation and, and everything that you were doing, how do you think that contributed to your decision to go out on your own?

Lisa Poliak: Well, it was very, very direct correlation because I was actually in a program to receive licensure with an organization that I'm no longer affiliated with. And as part of the program, you had to do a personal project. And I was already informally doing this on my own. And one of my classmates said to me, oh, you should start your own company.

And I kept saying, I can't do that, and I don't have time to do that with being in this training program. And then the second year of the program, they assigned us this personal project. And this was in like early 2009 and I decided that for my personal project I was gonna take what I was doing and really turn it into a company and I got a DBA and a business name and did all of that.

Heather Pridemore: So for those listening, Lisa, who maybe have had thoughts similar to yours where they're like. I wanna start my own business, but I don't have the background, I don't have the education. You know? What did that, like, what did those first steps look like for you? Like where did you sort of muster the confidence and the, like, know-how to kind of get started?

Lisa Poliak: Well, I would say I didn't have a lot of know-how, and I would say I really did a lot of things on the force of my personality, because I'm a people person and I've always been good at connecting with people and cultivating relationships with people. And I had, you know, cultivated a lot of relationships with the clients that I had previously been working with, and they really liked me and I think there's never a perfect time to do anything, and I think that if we wait until we feel ready, I mean, many people have said this, there are a ton of, I think, famous quotes about this. If we wait until we're ready, we'll never do it. And so I think you just kind of have to take the leap and then you can learn what you need as you go.

I mean, certainly if I had probably taken a couple business classes or management classes, that wouldn't have been a terrible idea, but I didn't, and I just started doing it. But I think I was confident in my skillset. That's the thing. I was, I had that to ground me. I was confident in my skillset and I knew I was good at what I was doing, and I was already getting good results at what I was doing. So I knew I could keep doing that.

Heather Pridemore: Now, Lisa, you have this interesting philosophy about being your own boss, and I find this, I find this particularly interesting as another entrepreneur, right? And so could you talk a little bit about this boss philosophy? We'll call it.

Lisa Poliak: Well, it's so interesting, Heather, because people who don't work for themselves often romanticize what it's like to have your own company and to be an entrepreneur, and people always say to me, oh, you're so lucky. You work for yourself. You have so much freedom. You don't have a boss. And that is true to a degree.

I do have freedom. But when you work for yourself, if you are in any kind of business with clients, your clients really are your boss because you have to keep your clients happy and you have to be available to your clients. You have to be responsible for your clients. You have to be responsible for the success of whatever you are doing with your clients to a great degree.

Obviously they have some, you know, responsibility for that as well. It's a two-way street, but I just think it's kind of naive that people often say, oh, you don't have to worry about having a boss because your clients are your boss. Because if they don't wanna work with you, you won't have income and if they don't pay you, you don't get paid.

So you go from having a traditional boss to really your client's being your boss. And if I can elaborate on that for a moment, one thing I think is very important, which it really took me years and years of having my own business before I really got better about this and figured it out, is about setting boundaries.

Because if you have your own business, and especially depending on what kind of clients you're working with, if you're working with pretty high-end clients, as I do. People will expect you to be available 24/7. And if you don't wanna be available 24/7 and you want to have off hours and a personal life and have any kind of work life balance, you have to really create those boundaries for yourself.

And now I'm very clear about my policies about I don't work on weekends, what my business hours are during the week because people will often be contacting you expecting an immediate response. And texting has made that so much more so, that people will be texting you at nine at night, 10 at night and expect you to respond.

And I, I don't wanna do that. And so one thing that I do is I make my business hours very clear. I've actually added recently a clause to my contract about my communication policy, which says that communications will be responded to within 24 business hours. So for example, you know, if someone emails me on a weekend or emails me at 6:00 PM on a Friday.

I know that I can wait until Monday to respond to them. Obviously, if it's something that's an absolute emergency, I usually try to get, you know, back to people as soon as I can and I really am there for my clients. But I think that's very important. And then if I can even add one more point to that, I think having mental boundaries is really important, and that's something that I have worked on a lot and really got some guidance.

Years ago I went to this women's empowerment dinner that a client had actually invited me to that was run by another coach and she had you draw a pie chart of your life and work was, this was many, many years ago when I was newer and less established and work was taking up such a huge slice of the pie for me. And then

one of the things I realized in speaking at the meeting and speaking to her is that it was really hard for me to have mental boundaries because I would worry a lot and if something was going on, I would, you know, take it home with me, so to speak, and be worrying about it at night and wake up during the night thinking about it, wake up in the morning and really not take that

personal time for myself to focus on the things that I wanted to be doing outside of my income generating work, like my own writing and all those practices for my own wellbeing and other things of just having a personal life. And so I think it's very important to establish boundaries with your clients, that they know what to expect from you of when you will and won't be available, and how fast you'll respond.

And what are the best means of communication to use? Like do you prefer emails, do you prefer text? Do you prefer phone calls? But then also really creating those mental boundaries within yourself, which is really a practice. And it's not easy.

Heather Pridemore: I think Lisa, it's kind of interesting 'cause we're talking about what it means to be an entrepreneur and the boundaries and kind of policies and procedures that you have to put in place. But I actually think these things are really important for people who are in a traditional like W2 type of position as well.

And it's very important to figure out what do those boundaries look like. Make sure that you're communicating them to your colleagues, to your employer. Making sure you understand what the expectation is as far as like, you know, how quickly do you need to respond to things and sort of what is the standard operating procedure.

And sometimes those questions can really tell you a lot about a culture of an organization. So for folks that are interviewing right now, you know, you might get deep into the interview process and you may wanna ask some questions surrounding that work life balance and you know, those communication practices and what are the expectations of the company.

So I think, you know, I agree with you, Lisa, wholeheartedly as an entrepreneur, it's really important to set those boundaries. And even when I was working a W2 position, but I was in the vendor space, I worked with clients and I actually

carry two cell phones for that reason. So my personal cell phone and my work cell phone and work is on one phone, life is on the other.

And when I go on vacation or when I was, you know, on the weekend, I didn't take my work phone places with me because not only did I want that mental ability to separate. I wanted a physical way to separate as well, and so I, you know, that was my practice. Other people have different strategies, but I do think those boundaries are incredibly important.

Lisa Poliak: Yeah, that's so smart. The two phone thing. Many, many people recommend that, and I think that is very smart.

Heather Pridemore: Now it, I wanna segue a little bit here, Lisa, because I think our next topic kind of is like almost counterintuitive to the concept of boundaries. And so, not only did you and I connect on the idea of entrepreneurship, but we o we both also connected on the fact that we, we've both been dealing with some health issues for a few years, a number of years, and, you know, when you talked about boundaries, I think that there is a, an approach we take in our lives to kind of compartmentalize certain aspects of things, keep certain things divided from each other, but there was a point where you felt compelled to bridge the gap between your personal health challenges and your professional life.

And so I would just love to hear you talk a little bit about how that sort of initially forced transparency really transformed your relationship with your clients and your perspective on vulnerability and support.

Lisa Poliak: Well that's a, that's a great and complex question, Heather. So I unfortunately have a recurrent autoimmune illness, and I had it once in 2003 before I started my company and they said it was a one time freak thing, it would never come back. And then it came back in 2005 and then I got better and was completely healthy.

Started my company in 2009, was completely healthy for 12 years, thought I would never come back again. And in 2017, unfortunately, it came back. Very seriously, and I was very sick for two years, from 2017 to 2019 because I am self-employed and I'm single. I had to keep working the whole time as much as I could.

I was literally in the hospital working, but I really wasn't talking about it to any of my clients. And also if new clients would call me, of course I wouldn't mention it because I would be scared that they would be afraid to hire me because they'd be worried I would be sick and wouldn't be able to do the job.

Even right now, this is the first time I've ever spoken about this publicly like this, and so it's a big step for me, very vulnerable to share this and not have that fear that somehow people will be listening to this and then get you know, turned off of working with me or be afraid I won't be able to do the job.

But I'm a really strong person and I had to keep working and I kept doing the job and I kept doing a good job, but it was really challenging and because I was sick for such a long time and was getting a treatment that was extremely expensive, I had really, really high medical bills and it was really hard to take care of all my expenses while I was sick, and people kept suggesting to me that I started GoFundMe, but I felt so much shame about doing that, and I said, oh, I can't do that.

That's so humiliating. I'm not gonna ask people for money. And also, I didn't think people would really give me money, but after I had been sick for over a year, I reached a point that I didn't know what I was gonna do because the medical bills were just really overwhelming. And a friend, a really good friend of mine who lived in lives in New York, who long time friend offered to start a GoFundMe for me and run the campaign for me.

And when we did that, what you do when you start a GoFundMe is that you solicit everyone you know to donate if they will. And we sent it to all of my clients. We sent it to all of my clients, current clients, former clients who I had, you know, anyone I had a good relationship with, which was pretty much all my clients.

And the donation started pouring in and I was shocked. I mean, I was flabbergasted. I couldn't believe how generous people were and how much people cared, and it, it was really amazing because we set an initial goal of $10,000 and I thought there was no way I would raise that much money. And we raised that money so quickly that we ended up raising the goal twice and ultimately raising almost $30,000.

And the things that my clients wrote to me and you know, wrote on the campaign and the amounts of money that they donated. I had, you know, many, many clients who donated like $500. And I had one client who's a very, very successful person in the industry, as we say, out here in LA who donated $5,000 and that, and I had finished working with his daughter, and his daughter was in college.

And that really touched me and it, it made me feel so cared about. And you know, they always say that it's too bad you're dead for your own funeral because you don't get to hear all the nice things people say about you. But having that GoFundMe, it was almost like that because I have really never felt so cared about in my life because so many people donated money and everyone supported me and no one judged me or was freaked out about my illness.

I just saw people wanting me to get better and people really, really cared about me, and ever since then, I have been a lot more open about that, I, this is something I deal with. Another thing that's really interesting that I don't think I mentioned to you, but I tend to get a lot of students that have had very serious health problems.

I've worked with many high school kids who have had very, very serious health problems. In fact, I just worked with a boy this past college essay season who had brain and spinal cancer when he was nine, and he's gonna be going to college in the fall, and he's doing great now. But I feel like I can understand people who do have serious health problems or have had serious health problems on a different level than someone who never has.

And so it actually makes me a much, much better coach and makes me much more compassionate in, in being able to help people.

Heather Pridemore: You bring such a level of empathy to your clients, and then you also have, because of what you do, you have such an, like, impact on their lives, and yet you were kind of surprised when it was like reciprocated. And so where do you think that comes from? And, and I have my own sort of like, take, but I, I wanna hear yours first.

 When I say I have my own take, I mean for myself, not for you.

Lisa Poliak: I feel like when you have a service business, people are paying you to do a service. You know, they're paying you to do a service, and that's the relationship. I mean, many of my clients, I do build long-term relationships with. I become friends with, I stay in contact with them. But you don't expect if people have already paid you a lot of money to do a job for them, that they're going to just give you money just because you're sick. And so I think, and also I think I was really embarrassed. I think I was really, really embarrassed and I felt a lot of shame. I felt a lot of shame about asking for money. I thought, you know, I'm a highly educated, successful professional.

I shouldn't have to be asking other people for money. And I felt a lot of shame about talking about my illness and about, I was on steroids. I gained about 50 pounds on the steroids. I didn't look, I, I looked unrecognizable. Really. If you saw a photo of me, then I really looked unrecognizable and you had to post photos on the GoFundMe, you know, campaign.

And it was just a lot of vulnerability. But I think I just didn't expect. I don't know. I don't know beyond that, what the, that's a really good question. I think I have to reflect more because other than what I said, which seems a little bit simplistic, I'm not sure why I didn't expect that.

Heather Pridemore: I think, well, I think for me, the, the sort of reciprocation simply just comes from the fact that I've, in, in a lot of ways, I've been wired that way since I was really young, more of a giver than a taker. But I also know with my own health conditions, it really eroded my sense of identity. And so it was really challenging navigating this sort of new sense of self that was impacted by, like, in my case, a physical limitation and how that impacted you know me in a lot of different ways, right? And so when you're dealing with medical stuff, if you're having to take medication, you know, if you're, and then you're still trying to navigate your life as if nothing is different. And yet, in some ways everything is different. And so I, you know, I know for myself it was a very, it was very impactful to my sense of self and like personal identity. I mean, I am still navigating my health journey and I've had to take some alternative routes, we'll just put it that way 'cause I know you're gonna talk a little bit more about, some of the steps you've taken. And I, I think this relates, but I've had to take some alternative routes to make the progress that I've made and to be able to find myself, you know, my sense of self in my agency in this process.

I, I really resonate with what you said. Not, not the thing about only being a giver and not a taker, because I think I'm a very good receiver. People always tell me they like to give me gifts because I get so excited. But I think you know the identity. Yes. Because when it first happened the first time. My entire identity was completely upended and there was a lot of shame about it back then.

Lisa Poliak: Just that I looked different physically, that I couldn't do the things I would normally do and the limitations. And also our society doesn't really talk, I think this is changing, but I think our society doesn't really talk a lot about illness or about death, and those are two things that make people very, very uncomfortable.

And I feel like if someone is very ill and other people can't say anything that's like a pat easy answer or just say like, oh, don't worry, it's gonna be okay. People don't know what to say, you know, a lot of people don't know what to say and they don't know how to relate to you. And so I also had my identity completely upended.

And then to have it be something that I thought would be a one-time thing, and then have it come back and then be completely, I made a, after the second time, I made a ton of life changes. And that was when I moved back to California and that was when I got involved with this personal growth work. And so then to have it come back again 12 years later, it was, it was, it was really, really a shock.

And it really does take over your identity if it's something, you know, really serious. That's a all consuming thing as mine has been because you just can't do the things that you used to do and you have to spend so much time focused on your health and on treatment and on doctor's appointments. And I was in and out of the hospital a lot and kept trying different treatments to find what would work.

So I think that, and when you, you know, are a professional, in a way you want to just put on, not not put on, but you wanna look to people you know, like you just have it all together. And obviously if you're sick. You can't have it all together. And so there's that. But then I think when you can really become comfortable being vulnerable, there's a real power in that.

And I think now there's much more awareness about that and much more of a, you know, movement about that with the work of Brene Brown and other people that we can find strength in our vulnerability. If I may just add one more thing. I think also when you're vulnerable, you give other people permission to be vulnerable.

And I think when you're, this is something my entire life I feel I've done about being authentic, that when you're authentic, you give other people the power for them to be authentic as well, because they feel empowered and they feel comfortable. Oh, if someone. Can be real. I can be real too. Or I don't have to pretend.

I don't have to pretend everything's okay, or I can speak up about what's going on in a room just to give a hypothetical example or whatever the case may be. And I think that's just my personality. That's something that I, I have always done. But this was really a different level of the vulnerability because it was something so personal.

Heather Pridemore: And I think it's extra taxing too when you're navigating, you know, health issues. There's already a whole set of, new things to deal with in that arena. And then if you're trying to keep that compartmentalized and try to maintain, you know, this other side of yourself, this like professionalism and this, everything's okay.

Nothing's wrong, you know, please don't look over here, you know, that kind of thing. It, it's, it adds a layer of, taxation and exhaustion to the situation because now you're not just navigating these like two distinct things, but you're also having to manage that space in between them to kind of keep them divided.

And it just adds a layer of, you know, a way of just like wearing you down even more. And so I think lots of people can probably relate, not just with health issues, but I mean, imagine if you were going through a divorce and you were trying to

keep that separate from work or, you know, you'd experienced a death in your family.

And to your point, sometimes people don't know how to respond to that sense of loss and the grieving process. And so you're doing your best to manage your feelings so that you don't make other people feel uncomfortable, and so that you can kind of have that division between work and life.

But the reality is, is work is part of our life, whether we're entrepreneurs or employed, it's a part of our life and you can't really truly separate the two things.

Lisa Poliak: That's true. Yes.

Heather Pridemore: So that kind of leads us to our next topic, Lisa, because you know, you're really starting to focus now on channeling this health journey that you've experienced. You're working on a memoir and you're starting to step into some patient advocacy and, you know, these are areas that are gonna be, that have been like pivotal to your own survival and treatment journey.

Could you share how your past experiences are shaping your decisions to advocate not only for yourself, but for others, and the process of reflecting on this journey for your memoir. Yeah.

Lisa Poliak: There's a lot to unpack there. 

So the advocacy is so important, and anyone who goes through the medical system in this country will learn that if you don't advocate for yourself, you could die, really. I was misdiagnosed when I first got sick, I was mis medicated. I was in a hospital that has now clo been closed down for three weeks and they were basically letting me die.

And then a visiting doctor said to me, if you don't get out of this hospital, you're going to die. And I had to go against medical advice to get into a different hospital, so I was advocating for myself the entire time I was sick in that way, and I was fortunate to have my mother with me, and she's not a very outspoken personality, unlike me, but she also had to really become much more vocal to advocate for me and that was the first level of the advocacy of the, just the self-advocacy of just speaking up, even making sure that the nurses read the chart when they came in the room, because they often don't read it and then they give you the wrong medication. That was an old medication that was prescribed or something like that.

Then when I was very sick from 2017 and 2019, I had a lot of issues with my health insurance and I had a treatment I was getting that had been recommended prior, and I called my health insurance and they said, oh, this is covered on the phone. And then they later told me it wasn't covered and I had a bill for $30,000 just for that one treatment, and I started getting another treatment that cost $16,000 a day and it was really overwhelming and dealing with, you know, when you talked about the energy it takes to compartmentalize while you're going through an illness, the energy it takes to deal with the health insurance system is a whole nother thing. And someone told me about this amazing organization called the Patient Advocate Foundation based in Virginia, and I'm in California as I mentioned, and I contacted them and it is a free organization.

They do not charge any money to patients. And they started helping me navigate. They actually fought about that issue with the $30,000 bill that the insurance has said was covered all the way up to the Managed Care Board of California, which is the highest level in the health insurance regulation. It took a long time, but it ended up getting paid for by the insurance, and they taught me a lot of terms, a lot of things I didn't know. For example, surprise billing and surprise billing is, let's say you're in the hospital, Heather, and they send in some doctor to talk to you for five minutes that you didn't ask for, and then later you get a bill for 1200 bucks. And you're like, what is that bill for? And it's like, oh, that's for Dr. Smith, who you didn't ask for and didn't actually do anything but came in your room for five minutes. And Dr. Smith isn't on your insurance plan. And even though you're in a hospital that's covered on your insurance plan, and even though most of your doctors are on your insurance plan, Dr. Smith isn't. And stuff like that happens all the time, or you're in the hospital and you're seeing a bunch of doctors that are all on your plan, but then certain doctors that get recommended for you aren't on your plan. And you can't check that out when you're in the hospital, you're there trying to stay alive and trying to get better.

And so the Patient Advocate Foundation, which I had no idea existed, that something like this existed. Gave me so much help taught me, you know? And then also when you do get that surprise billing, one thing people don't know, you can call the doctor's office and protest it and you can say, I didn't know this was gonna happen.

I didn't know this doctor wasn't my plan. And you can ask to have the bill reduced, or even in some cases have the bill just fully removed. And so I have helped a lot of people in a casual way of talking to people I know who are going through problems or whose parents are going through things about how to deal with the system.

And then I also simultaneously have been working on this memoir that I've wanted to write for many, many, many years about my experiences because I think I have a very powerful story and a very powerful journey that's pretty inspiring of how I've survived and how I've thrived and had this fulfilling life despite having this terrible thing that has come back several times.

And I found out the Patient Advocate Foundation is actually having a conference called the Patient Insight Congress, which is for patients to come and give their input to provide more holistic care and to improve the medical system for patients. And I actually applied for a scholarship to go to the conference and wrote an essay about my experiences and I was very excited because I found out recently that I won a full scholarship and I'm going to this conference for three days in April in Atlanta, which is for patients and caregivers and people in the medical profession.

Because this whole organization works, I don't wanna really speak on behalf of the organization, but because I don't represent them, but their whole purpose is to help patients and also I think, improve the system. So some of the things that happen to me that they help me with don't happen to patients. And separate from the billing issue, I don't wanna go on too long, but there's a whole issue of being dehumanized when you're in the hospital or being dehumanized in the doctor's office and the way that they talk to you, and especially when this first started 20 years ago, you know, and being a, being a younger woman, and all of my doctors at the time being male, and the way that I was treated, very, very insensitively and a lot of assumptions were made.

And there was also absolutely no regard for my privacy whatsoever in the way things were done to me and to my body, and questions that were asked to me in front of other people and all kinds of things. And so, I believe part of their mission, and I'll learn more when I go to the conference, is not just about the financial side of it, but just to improve the way people are treated.

Because you know, as you may know, being in the hospital can be a very dehumanizing experience, and even going to the doctor can be a dehumanizing experience.

Heather Pridemore: Yeah, there were some elements of my own journey, Lisa, where I definitely felt, a level of, you know, being dehumanized and I think, you know, for me, the struggle was something where no one could give me an answer, but they also weren't giving me any alternative like avenues to find answers. And so in my own journey, I mean I was going to multiple doctors, different kinds of doctors, seeing specialists, asking for second opinions, and it, at one point I finally was just like, okay, I'm done talking to all these male doctors.

I wanna talk to a woman doctor to see if I get any kind of different information. I'm, I'm sort of unfortunately reporting back that like it didn't change anything. In that particular instance, I was super disappointed because I just thought, well, maybe she'll understand me in a way that's different than these other doctors. But I also think, because I was dealing mostly with surgeons at that point, there was some shared surgeon mentality and, you know, it was like, well, we don't have the answer for you, but we can't like, advise you on any other like, exploratory paths to take to figure this out. And so I, I mean, I left many a doctor appointment just crying in the parking lot because I felt so alone. And, you know, the doctors weren't helping me. They were supposed to be the experts. My friends and family couldn't help me because they weren't the experts. And I felt completely overwhelmed because I was trying to navigate getting better and still being a professional and a mom and a wife and all of these other people that I was before I was dealing with like a health issue. And so I mean, taxing, so taxing.

Lisa Poliak: I just would like to piggyback on that, Heather, because that is so relatable and I mean, I've been to countless doctors and you know. Also, a lot of them had the savior complex where everyone would say, I'm gonna figure this out. I'm gonna be the one to figure this out. And they would eventually ghost me long before ghosting was a popular term.

You know, I would have these different doctors I would have consultations with, and they would say, I have no idea what's going on with you, Lisa, but I'm gonna get to the bottom of this. And every single one of them did eventually just disappear and just drop my case. And there's still really no answer because the illness that I have, even though I'm saying it's an autoimmune, and I, that's how I deal with it now, it's considered idiopathic, which means no one really knows what causes it, but just the best guess is that it's autoimmune. And I've had to take things into my own hands as well, Heather, and that's exactly right. No one gives you, you know, another route to take when they can't help you.

Or they say things like, well, this is just something you're gonna have to live with. And that's one of the things that after the first time that they told me, oh, it's a one-time freak illness, then it was, no, this is gonna just keep coming back. And some of the doctors said very, very depressing things to me.

Like, oh, you've had this twice. Now, it's probably gonna come back, you know, every one to two years, which didn't happen. And so I think I have had to do, you know, a whole huge range of different things as far as holistic care, as far as mindset, as far as diet and lifestyle, and also the western route and eastern medicine and acupuncture.

I, I take a very, very holistic route to everything now, and I think for every person it's individual and everyone in our culture seems like they wanna find, you know, one silver bullet, that's a pill you can take or something that is gonna just make your problem go away or make you healthy. But unfortunately, for most people with complex conditions and also autoimmune conditions are so, you know, rapidly on the rise, which is a whole nother topic that I think says a lot about our society and stress levels and stress with work and all of that. So it, it's all interrelated. You know, you really have to be your own advocate in every way because you have to figure out works for you.

 Because when you first get sick, I think you go in with this idea that, oh, the what you said, the doctors know what they're doing, but they're guessing too.

They're guessing too, and especially if you have a rare problem, they really don't know what to do. If you have a very common problem, that's something that a lot of people get, there's an established treatment, but if you, or you know, I have friends now that are dealing with things that kind of mirror what you're talking about, where no one can even really make a diagnosis, you know?

And no one, no one can even, and in my case, I didn't get a diagnosis the first time and they said, oh, this is just a one time freak thing. So you have to be your own advocate. And it takes in, in my opinion, it takes pulling together so many different modalities and everything that you can do to help yourself.

Heather Pridemore: Now, Lisa, you have some tips for people who might be navigating, whether it be, like an illness or even just a major crisis, and so would you be willing to share those with us?

Lisa Poliak: Yes, I would love to. I've actually broken this down into a four point list about how to deal with a major illness, and I think it can also be applied to any life crisis number one, which goes back to our last area we were talking about is be willing to ask for and accept help. Many people don't like to get help, and having a serious illness forces you to, if you are not willing to ask for help, if you are not willing to accept help, you are creating a huge barrier for yourself.

Number two is maintain your sense of humor, no matter how dark it is. And in my mind, this is really the key to survival. I always had a sense of humor, even when things were horrible and I was in terrible pain. There were times when, you know, I would be in my hospital bed and all the residents that were around my bed would be laughing because I was still cracking jokes, because that's my personality.

And I feel like without a sense of humor. I would be dead right now. Number three is don't try to deny how shitty it is while you're going through it. I hope it's okay to say that because especially in the spiritual community that I used to be involved with, they had a expression, life is good all the time, and people did a lot of what we refer to as spiritual bypass, which is where when someone's really dealing with something serious, they try to minimize it or say, oh God is good, so everything is goo. And I'm sorry, but life is not good all the time. Horrible, horrible things happen all the time. I don't think people that are in the middle of war zones right now are thinking life is good all the time. And so I think when you're going through a really serious illness or a crisis and you try to minimize how bad it is to make yourself feel better.

You actually just make it worse. So I think that sometimes you just have to admit that things suck and you're in a really sucky situation right now. But this is a perfect segue into my last point. You have to believe it's going to get better. You have to believe you can heal no matter what. And that has always been true for me, even when.

It seemed like I was gonna die even when I was in very bad situations, and doctors would tell me very negative things. I always believed I would get better no matter what, and what that looks like depends because now I live with something that I know is recurrent, and when I had originally envisioned writing my memoir before I got sick again in 2017, I thought it was just gonna be the story of healing, of having this thing two times and then getting better and staying better.

And that's a nice, happy ending. But that's not the case now because I know it's something that could come back. I hope it doesn't come back again, but I've had it several times and so I really focus on continuing to thrive in my life. I focus on continuing to do as many things as I possibly can, Heather, that make me happy and give me a sense of purpose and fulfillment and focus on how I can help others.

And that's really what my entire business is about, is about having a sense of purpose and fulfillment and helping others achieve their potential. Which really makes me feel good, and I love having a job where I get to see a concrete result of what I've done with a client and see 'em succeed. So I think having a sense of purpose and helping others are really deeply intertwined for me and that that is just so importan, is that no matter what you're dealing with, when you're in the midst of it, when you're in the thick of it, you probably can't do that. And when you're in the thick of it, you have to just focus on surviving. But when you're at a point that you're stable enough, you really have to focus on doing whatever gives you joy.

And having that joy and having that sense of purpose. And for me, I've been fortunate that my career does give me a lot of joy and a lot of sense of purpose.

Heather Pridemore: I can relate with a lot of what you shared, Lisa. You know, I think for me, if I had to say there was like a, a bottom of my journey, it was when I finally got to the place that I could admit to other people how shitty the situation I was dealing with was. And it wasn't until I got to that point that I could start taking some of those other steps you talked about, right.

As far as like advocating for myself and, believing that I could heal, right? Because I, I was just struggling so much to just kind of hold it all together. And then I got to this place where I was just like, I, you know, I, this sucks, right? This really sucks. And I started sharing that with people. And then it was through that process of sharing that I was just like, no, I can't let this be like the rest of my life.

And it was that point where I started saying, okay, I am gonna figure out how to fix this. And then that process led me down a totally different path. So I can relate with a lot of what you're saying, and I think there's a lot of wisdom in those words, but we are approaching the end of our show, Lisa and I like to end each episode by asking if someone said, you know what, this, this whole episode was way too long. I did not listen. What is the one thing that you would want them to take away from this conversation?

Lisa Poliak:: Really go for what makes you happy in life. Go for what makes you happy in life and know that you can survive anything and be resilient. And even if you're in a really, really dark shitty place right now, know that things are gonna get better.

 Heather Pridemore: And I think that is a great place to end the episode. Thank you so much, Lisa.

Lisa Poliak: Thank you so much, Heather. It was such a pleasure.